Episode: Future planning

Where to start with planning ahead

How to tackle wills, guardianship, power of attorney and be clear about the legal processes you might need to undertake with a dementia diagnosis.

Hold the Moment podcast S01E02: Future planning

Transcript

[BEGINNING OF RECORDED MATERIAL]

Kevyn: Hello, my name is Kevyn. I am a First Nations advocate with Dementia Australia. For more than 50,000 years we have come together to trade knowledge, to learn and to teach. Today, we join to keep up that tradition. So with that in mind, we now pay our respects to the traditional owners, to Elders past and present, to those First Nations people joining us here today.

Hamish: G'day guys, good morning. How are you?

Tyler: Yeah, well.

Jim: Yeah. Morning.

Hamish: How do you feel being back in Sydney?

Jim: Raises quite a lot of emotion, I suppose. Because you contemplate on the decisions you made to make a move. But yeah, we love Sydney; made a lot of good friends in Sydney as well.

Tyler: Yeah. It takes a few years to get established in a place. And so we're in Brisbane now. And we've been there, just under two years now.

Hamish: So just explain to me, who the hell are you?

Tyler: I'm Tyler. So I'm Jim's husband. We've been married for 11 years.

Jim: When I was diagnosed with younger onset Alzheimer's in 2021, I was living in Sydney with my husband, Tyler. We knew straightaway we had some big decisions to make: like whether to stay in Sydney, or move to Brisbane, so our kids and grandkids could be closer.

There's so many life-changing things you have to think through when you get a dementia diagnosis. You have to totally rearrange your life to new circumstances, which can feel pretty overwhelming. That's why Ty and I would usually head to our favourite park, just to pause and take stock.

Hamish: You got your coffees, how was the walk?

Tyler: It was good.

Jim: Yeah, a bit overcast, but still a beautiful walk.

Hamish: Glebe foreshore is a beautiful spot, obviously. And this must bring back a lot of memories for you. I know, when my dad was diagnosed, that was a prompt for us to move him up to Sydney and to be closer to the care that he needed. For you guys, are you sort of reflecting on that moment in time, now that you're back here?

Tyler: Yeah, I think, you know, certainly when we lived in Sydney, we used to do this walk every single day. So it was really, you know, certainly key and pivotal for us prior to Jim's diagnosis, but also, more so, post the diagnosis.

Hamish: Can you describe what it's like when you are confronted with some really big and difficult news like this, to then have to make a whole bunch of really consequential life decisions? That might shape the rest of your existence?

Jim: I think we were lucky in the fact that we had done major moves prior. So we'd done international moves and interstate. So we'd had a bit of apprenticeship for it.

Hamish: What about the wills and the power of attorney and power of guardianship, all that stuff?

Jim: That's just horrific. When you're young, as I feel. When you're young, to be sat down and told you need to get your affairs in order, and do it sooner rather than later. Because there's no predictability about the amount of time you have, that you could lose that ability. It's just really confronting. It's just something you don't think you're going to have to do. And it was really hard, wasn't it, to actually think how to do it, who to involve in it?

One of the big things you're told after your diagnosis is to “go and get your affairs in order". But what does that even mean? And how do you go about it? I'm Jim Rogers.

Hamish: And I'm Hamish Macdonald. This is Hold the Moment, a podcast from Dementia Australia. It's full of real stories about life after diagnosis. We're looking at how to make planning your future with dementia: things like your will, power of attorney or advanced care, a bit more empowering.

You're going to meet a woman named Pam, who's designed her very own bright blue custom coffin as part of her 'active dying plan' as she calls it. You'll also hear from a legal expert who's going to break down the paperwork process for you and make that a bit simpler, including what your options are, if you don't have close family around to help navigate your affairs. I know that's something we've had to do with my dad following his diagnosis with Lewy body dementia, but I often wonder what happens if he didn't have close family or friends around to help him with that stuff?

Jim: And I'll tell you what this has looked like for me so far. Let's go back to the part where my husband Tyler and I had a lot of these big conversations.

Tyler: When we had the diagnosis from the doctor, and then we were given health specialists to, you know, navigate, help us navigate through the next steps. You know, and I think I remember getting these sort of checklists, which sort of had, you know, the steps and things that you need to do. It seemed very straightforward, didn't it? We'd already done our wills, to a degree, but we sort of finalised those with.

Jim: I think it just was just very emotional, because it just felt very real.

Hamish: Are there particular questions or particular things you had to think about that really kind of stood out? For you?

Jim: I think the worst thing for me was at what stage would you go into care? Or what stage would - when you feel as though it would be appropriate for them to say: "We're not coping anymore? He needs to go into a home?" And also, who would sign off on that? Those confronting discussions were – it just felt a bit out-of-body-experience, as though it wasn't real. And I think you're in denial for a long time. Truly.

Hamish: How did you have that conversation?

Tyler: I think we had it with, um, with Daisy didn't we?

Jim: Yeah.

Tyler: After after.

Hamish: Daisy is your daughter?

Jim: Yeah.

Tyler: And so she's on, she's listed as well. So I think it was very, it was very challenging to talk about somebody that was clearly at the time in good health, and that respect of you know, from a, when you look at that person, there's, you know, there's nothing wrong with them. It's not like when somebody, you know, has cancer, or something like that, where they've gone through chemo, and you can visually see the impacts. I think, where we, where we had to kind of take a 'stockcheck', I think almost for want of a better word around talking about something that we didn't even want to contemplate.

Jim: Yeah

Tyler: So that was, that was the challenging part. Because you're, you're talking about, okay, well, you know, if James gets to the point where he can't swallow anymore. Do you have the DNR in place with the 'Do Not Resuscitate' at that point? When does it kick in? So there's all these different elements, when it comes to the impacts the Alzheimer's disease has on somebody, and what that will look like, in the future.

Jim: And it's very hard to convey it to anybody, unless you really go through it. So, for me, anybody who gets this diagnosis, or somebody who cares for somebody who's going through this diagnosis, it's just horrific. That's the only word I can really use - an emotional roller coaster it sends you on - it's devastating.

Hamish: How do you navigate Ty the, the emotional, and, you know, the obvious feelings that you would have associated with decisions like that, and the practical, the pragmatic?

Tyler: I think I'm quite an emotional person. So anytime we sort of spoke about it, you know, it's upsetting. And so, with that emotion comes, you know, the tears and what have you. So, I think with the pragmatic side, when we looked at, doing the wills, and the power of attorney, and the enduring guardianship, we decided, you know, to do an enduring power of attorney so that, you know, James can carry on as normal for as long as he can. And then when he can't, I can just step in.

Hamish: Now that you have had, you know, some years to think about it and settle with these ideas, how do you think today about the possibility that at some point Jim might need, might actually need to be in care, residential care?

Tyler: Again, I'll cross that bridge, when we come to it, I kind of don't think about things like that too much. I don't dwell on things. I think we enjoy what time that we've got. And it's important about today, like we're here in Sydney today.

Jim: You would never thought in a million years we would be sat here, talking to Hamish about this and a diagnosis. Like it's so far-fetched. It's just too ridiculous. And I think also a lot of these things we don't really explore too much now because we're so focused on trying to enjoy 'the now'. I think we're over the moon, because I'm doing so well at the moment. So I think we thought: "Shit, this is gonna really..." you know, you don't know the speed of it.

So I feel really good and I'm doing everything I possibly can: vitamins and sleep and meditation and everything you can do, to try and stay good. So I think we're just trying to enjoy 'the now' aren't we?

Pam: My name is Pam Eade. I live in a small country town called Granya in rural Victoria with my husband Brian, who is my carer and absolutely wonderful and I'm so very lucky to have him. Next month we've been married 43 years.

Hamish: Pam was diagnosed with a form of younger onset dementia after a friend noticed her word recall wasn't what it used to be.

Pam: Every day he would comment on my speech and my husband finishing my sentences for me. And I said: "You be together 40 odd years, you too can talk like this." And then after he left, we had friends travelling through. And on the second day, she said: "Can I ask you a question?" And I went "yes": She said, “would you like me to finish your sentences for you, or wait until you can find the words?” It was very confronting. And then I immediately that day rang and made an appointment with my GP, who understood, after I'd also had a period of apathy earlier in the year where nothing gave me any pleasure, I had no sense of joy, whether it be food or surroundings, or - anyway, we put two and two together and he got me a referral to the cognitive memory and dementia area in Albury and the speech pathologist came out. And she was heavily pregnant. And she said to me when she left that: "When I get back from maternity leave, I will see you." And I thought: "oooh, she has picked up on something". I'm 60, yes 60 now.

Hamish: So how old were you when?

Pam: Fifty-eight. So and to be honest, I'd never heard of younger onset dementia. I'd never heard of primary progressive aphasia. So it was all new territory to me. So yeah, so I got the diagnosis. And that was it. But I'm very lucky because I was diagnosed early. I find that as an advantage, because that allowed me to do what I did to get my - I call my 'active dying plan' - out of the way. And now I'm on my 'active living plan'. And my adventure with dementia.

Jim: Which is a great slogan.

Pam: I like it. I think, well, I'm going through territory that I've never been through before. So why not have an adventure with it?

The progression of primary progressive aphasia for me, means that my language skills will deteriorate, my comprehension will go, my ability to read - to actually comprehend what I'm reading, to form the memories of what I'm reading and looking at and experiencing - will go. And then it will progress to a stage where I honestly don't want to be at. I was given the wrong information, not by Dementia Australia, but by my GP at the start, and by other people who said, “three to five years, you won't be able to talk, you won't be able to communicate”, and all these things that go along with my line of dementia. So I had a 'penultimate 60th birthday party', so, which was huge, and I was surprised how many of my friends didn't know what 'penultimate' meant. So I got all those 60th birthday cards, and it's like: "I'm only 59 this year!". But it did, it allowed me to, to explore all the options. And that's what I said: getting my active dying plan together. And I don't have to worry, because that, to me, is the only thing I can give my loved ones, my carers at the end, because I won't be able to do anything to help them. So I can help them by not having to worry about any of those things that need to be done.

Hamish: You mentioned what you call the 'active dying plan'.

Pam: Yeah!

Hamish: What do you mean?

Pam: Getting all my affairs in order, getting, I had my advanced care plan done. My best friend is a nurse and teaches nursing and she and I sat down and we spent quite a few hours doing the advanced care plan, which I recommend everybody getting done, no matter what age, or whether a dementia diagnosis or not.

Hamish: What's involved in that?

Pam: It’s looking at everything that you want done. And also, if you're hospitalised, whether you want to be kept on life support, whether you - if it is a matter of when you come out of say, having a stroke, if you're going to retain what you had prior to having a stroke, or if you're really impacted and will have no quality of life after. So all those things that actually - whether you want music in your room, whether you want a priest, minister come in and administer to you, to give you last rites, everything - sort of as covered in the advanced care plan. And launched that with my doctor, who then goes, it goes on to the record, and therefore anywhere, if I have a car accident and something comes up, then they know exactly what I want done. So I've got my will, my Enduring Power of Attorney done, um.

Jim: What prompted you to actually go ahead and organise this advanced care plan? Was it something your neurologist said to you? Or was it something that you were advised to do? Or did you get that diagnosis and just go "right: what am I going to do?" How did you come to that decision?

Pam: Because my best friend, with her nursing background, she knew exactly what people go through at the end in, in you know, in really severe cases of not just dementia, as I said, whether it be a car accident or any way, and it was like, really, it would be best that you do this now, while you are still capable of doing that. Because as we know, like with VAD in Victoria, once you're diagnosed with a neurological degenerative disease, you can no longer make those decisions.

Jim: Yeah

Pam: So yeah.

Jim: And also there's a time scale where you don't know how long you've got to make that decision.

Pam: You don't know. I was told three to five years, I wouldn't be able to verbalise, I wouldn't be able to comprehend things. So that was quite a quick sort of decline that I was expecting. And I'm declining very slowly. So, for which I'm very grateful.

Jim: And there's a lot of anxiety that comes with that initial, you know, concept of thinking: "Christ am I going to have do this?"

Pam: Very quickly. I'm not going to get to my 70th birthday. I'm not going to get to my 50th wedding anniversary, which was really important to me, I wanted to get my 50th wedding anniversary, and I wanted to be able to remember it and to celebrate. But knowing that I won't, is hard.

Jim: Very.

You know, and my husband doesn't deserve to go through what he goes through. And in my opinion, people, the carers, the loved ones of those with dementia go through so much. And they need so much support that isn't given, or they can't reach out to, or it's difficult, the government.

Jim: Or don't know where to reach

Pam: Or don't know where to. That's where once again I found Dementia Australia great because they can put you in touch with the places that are necessary.

Jim: Can guide you.

Pam: So getting that all together and also having a solicitor that knows this is what you'll need to do so that we can get financial power of attorney or whatever it's called and all that organised because now I can sit back and say: "I've got everything done. You don't have to do anything when the time comes."

Hamish: So, one of the things you've organised ahead of time is your coffin. Tell us about that.

Pam: My niece's (now) fiance is a scrap metal merchant and goes to Melbourne, and he pulled up at a place and there was this huge $8,000 coffin with a dinted lid. And said, sent a picture and said: "Would Auntie Pam like this?" And Auntie Pam's gone: "Yes, yes. Yes, please!"

Hamish: But decoration-wise, you were showing us photos before. Can you describe it?

Pam: So we took all the lining out and all the rubber sort of sealing sections and everything out and we took it into him as a bare bones (if you'll excuse the pun) and he painted it for me. And that was his gift to me. And anyway, we got a beautiful - my husband found at Spotlight, this blue velour, royal blue velour. But one day we were in Kmart and we saw this cushion that says 'reserved'. So, I had to get that, so that's in my casket. And what I did for the handles, I left the handles the gold, because this is a metal casket and this casket weighs I think 110 kilos. And I know when I get in it, I won't be weighing that much. (And I don't now, by the way), but he's been a Melbourne supporter, Melbourne Football Club supporter longer than I've been alive. So I've got the end handles painted red for him. And he didn't know that. So when we went to pick it up, he was really very chuffed. That was my homage to him. So we took it home and relined it, and set it all up. And yeah.

Jim: Do you feel as though, because you've done a bit of that process, your housekeeping's in order and you feel a bit in control.

Pam: Yes

Jim: And on top of things?

Pam: Yes, definitely. And when I look at it, it's covered by a royal red blanket. And when I lift the blanket up to look at it and open the door and just see the beauty of the colour, it makes me smile. I know it might sound silly, but knowing that's there and knowing that is what I will be in, I'm happy.

Hamish: Why are you unafraid to look at the very end of this because for many people, I imagine that something that they might prefer to look away from.

Pam: My mother had an incident once where she had a near death experience. And she said that she saw all her loved ones on the other side of a river, picnicking and being together and they said: "It’s not your time". So, she came back. And she relayed that to me. And I like to think that when I die, I'll be reunited with all the loved ones that I've lost. And I think the only way to look at it is, hopefully, if nothing else, I'll be somewhere where I won't be suffering, where there will be no suffering. I'm a heathen atheist: I'm not a religious person at all. But I just like the thought that I'll get to see those I love again and not be, and I will be able to talk, I will be able to verbalise what I want to say. So, yeah.

Jim: A lot of that as well comes from the positivity you exude, really, that you've turned this into, instead of dwelling too heavily on all the bad side of it, you found a way to focus on - again, taking a bit of control, really - and being in charge of the process.

Pam: I think if you let the process take control of you, you're going to get terribly, terribly bogged down.

Jim: You spiral.

Pam: You’ll spiral, and it's easy enough to do. And yes, every day isn't a brilliant day. But if you can focus on one thing, and as I said, if you know that whatever makes you happy, if you look at that, and just allow yourself, even if it's a minute to be happy, because we all deserve to be happy. Just because we get dementia doesn't mean that we should be locked away and, you know, forgotten, and that we should live amongst and let people know. Because really, I see it's such a taboo subject, you see so much on breast cancer and cancers and everything else. Because there's a cure. Dementia, there's no cure. So why should we talk about it, why should we not lock people away, so we can't see them? So we don't know that they're struggling? We don't know that they need help. We don't know that they live amongst us, which we do.

Nola: I'm Nola Ries, and I'm a professor in the Faculty of Law at University of Technology, Sydney. I'm also a co-founder of the Dementia Law Network. And I also lead research with an Ageing Research Collaborative at UTS.

Hamish: Throughout this episode, we've heard lots of legalistic terms. So Nola, let's start with some explainers. I guess we all know what a will is. But what does it actually do?

Nola: The will is the document after a person has died, indicates how their assets and property should be distributed to beneficiaries.

Hamish: And so why exactly is that important?

Nola: The importance of doing it early is to avoid problems after a person has died. So, if a person dies without a will, then legislation steps in basically and says according to the law, this is how your assets will be distributed to people. So it might be that the person would really like to make different arrangements; there are particular charities, they might like to make sure that they make donations to them. They want to make sure particular people within their family or friend network are beneficiaries. So it just makes sure the person gets their own choice about how their assets are distributed after their death and means that government bodies don't need to come in and deal with that.

Hamish: And what is an enduring power of attorney?

Nola: An enduring power of attorney typically refers to financial power of attorney, so that an enduring means that the person appointed into that role acts even after the person has lost the capacity to make particular financial decisions. So, it's an enduring financial power of attorney is someone you would trust to manage your money and assets for you in the future, in the event that you're not able to do that.

Hamish: And what might that mean, in the case of someone living with dementia?

Nola: It might mean that the enduring financial power of attorney helps to manage money if the person with dementia needs home care services, for example, the financial power of attorney would make arrangements to make sure those services, the fees are paid. It might mean managing bills for other kinds of things, insurances; if a person perhaps would want a home sold if they might need to think about moving into residential accommodation, then a financial power of attorney would deal with all of those kinds of matters.

Hamish: And what about an enduring guardian?

Nola: The term for this role will vary across the states and territories, but the enduring guardian is somebody who would make health care-related decisions for an individual who's not able to make those decisions.

Hamish: What do we mean when we talk about ‘advanced planning’?

Nola: ‘Advanced planning’ refers to a broader range of decisions a person might make, thinking ahead to their future. So, coming from a legal background, I'm interested in legal planning. So legal planning can include things like naming people you trust to be your decision maker, should you lack capacity in the future to make particular decisions. So that can be an enduring financial power of attorney, an enduring guardian who would make health care decisions. It can also mean making advance directives, which often are more about care. So that fits into care planning. It can also mean looking ahead and making a will, thinking ahead to what one might want in terms of funeral arrangements, and so on. So there's a broad range of future decisions a person can think about and then make legal documents that express what their wishes and preferences are.

Hamish: So, I imagine if you are receiving a diagnosis that you're living with some form of dementia, that there's a lot to think about all at once. Do you need to make all of these decisions immediately, because I guess, one of the things you might be considering is, how long have I got to think this all through in a way that is, I guess, smart and going to be right, and in my own best interest?

Nola: Getting that timely recommendation to do planning is really important. People who do the planning sooner rather than later often find it an easier process and they've got more time to do it. At the same time, it can be daunting to think about all of these decisions. So any task that’s overwhelming, it's good just to think about breaking it down into smaller components. But then also think about what's the point of doing all of this legal planning, going off and seeing a solicitor and it is really about supporting the person's own choice: their control over the future. So there's, we know that when legal planning is done well, it has so many benefits. People feel relieved that they've done it, the person living with dementia, as well as those around them that, and it does avoid problems in the future.

So it does avoid unwanted medical care, it does reduce the risk of the person being financially exploited by an enduring power of attorney who should never have been appointed into that role, or who doesn't understand their role. It can also avoid disputes over a will. So after a person has passed away, there can be quite difficult legal problems within families. So the more the legal planning is done well, at the time, the more it avoids all of these future problems.

Hamish: A question I've often asked myself, you know, as we've gone through things with my dad is, what happens if you don't have four kids that can play these roles? Like what do people do when they don't necessarily have a close circle they can rely on to play these functions?

Nola: I hear time and again how people in those circumstances, they're not able to take up their legal rights because they don't have someone they trust. So, in that instance, it is helpful to think of broader networks that people have, to think about friendships, that there may be somebody who would be a suitable person to take on some of those roles. In terms of the financial decision-making and management, that is something that professionals - a legal or accounting professional - may act in those kinds of roles. So it is really important for people to think more broadly about options.

Hamish: And what about communication of your wishes or whatever it is that you've put down on paper, because people might, on some level think “yeah, I'm happy to do that”, but not necessarily understand what's going to be involved. Whose responsibility is that?

Nola: That is certainly something that the legal professional should be encouraging their client to do: to go away and have those conversations with those key people, especially the people appointed into those legal roles. And within interactions with healthcare professionals, there are opportunities to do that. There are systems like My Health Record, and a person can - if they have made an advanced care directive for, for example - upload their care directive to that online resource, so that a care directive is available to health professionals who may need access to it in the future, particularly down the track. If the person is admitted to hospital in more of an urgent situation, then health care providers know they can look at the health record, they can find the person's care directive if they have made one.

Jim: That was really helpful to hear that information from Nola. It can be really overwhelming to think about all the different paperwork at once, but it's good to know there's people like her, out there making it accessible.

Hamish: Yeah, and Dementia Australia actually has some great resources on the website around this, including a webinar on future planning that you can sign up for. We'll link to that in the show notes.

Jim: And if you feel like you just need to talk to someone about it all, you can call the National Dementia Helpline on 1800 100 500 and speak with a trained advisor about your situation. They're available 24 hours a day, every day of the year.

Hamish: Or you can just call Jim. Jim will take your call. [Laughter.]

Jim: Hold the Moment is a podcast from Dementia Australia. It’s produced by Deadset Studios. You can find more episodes and resources through the Dementia Australia website dementia.org.au. And don't forget to follow Hold the Moment in your podcast app, so you don't miss an episode. The show is hosted by me, Jim Rogers…

Hamish: …and by me, Hamish Macdonald. The executive producers Kellie Riordan and Grace Pashley. The producer is Liam Riordan sound designed by Sean Holden. A special thanks to the whole team at Dementia Australia and to all the advocates who shared their stories on this podcast.

[END OF RECORDED MATERIAL]

Bonus episode: getting your affairs in order

Helpful resources and tips for organising and planing for your future with dementia, from National Dementia Helpline staff.

Hold the Moment podcast S01E02: getting your affairs in order when living with dementia

Transcript

[BEGINNING OF RECORDED MATERIAL]

Jim: Planning for your future with dementia can be daunting. But after my diagnosis of younger onset Alzheimer's, I wanted to make sure I have things in place and my loved ones are looked after and my affairs are in order. I'm Jim Rogers. This is Hold the Moment, a podcast from Dementia Australia, full of stories about life after diagnosis. Dementia Australia have some really great resources on their website around this. There's a webinar on future planning that you can sign up for. We also have a whole podcast episode on this topic, you can download right now. If you're in need of someone to talk to about it all, you can call the National Dementia Helpline. They're available 24 hours a day, every day of the year. You could speak to an advisor, like Kristin.

Kristin: It can feel really overwhelming when someone tells you to 'get your affairs in order'. Like what does that even include? And how am I supposed to have that all done right away? The most important thing to know about getting your affairs in order is: it's important for you to get across what you want, and who you want to be the one to help you with that. And it doesn't all have to be done today. You can break it down into pieces and talk to people that you trust, to help you do each of these steps along the way. It's always okay to bring a support person with you, to any appointment or any questions that you've got. There might be a point in the appointment where the person that you're talking to, such as a solicitor, wants to speak just to you, to make sure that you are getting what you need from the appointment and you are getting what you want. But that doesn't mean that you can't bring a loved one along with you to help make sure that your questions are answered. And to help prompt anything that you might want to ask, but haven't remembered in the moment. When you're preparing to go and meet with your solicitor, it can be helpful to think ahead of time the kinds of questions you might want to ask. And especially when you're starting to think about the future and the medical decisions, it could be helpful to talk to your GP, to see what kinds of questions could be helpful to ask your solicitor and you could write those down and bring a list with you when you go. It's really up to you who you want to tell about these things. There might be some really important people in your life that you feel it's important to involve in knowing about what's going to happen. And it might be tricky to start that conversation.

You could call the helpline to have a chat about getting started in that conversation. Other times, you might feel like you don't want to let other people know about what your plans are. And that's why it's important to reach out to a solicitor and to get the legal piece of things completed. It can be really tricky to start the conversation about how you want things to go for the end of your life. There's always a piece of grief involved in that. And it can feel like you're worried about making other people sad, maybe be a little sad yourself. And that might happen in the conversation and that's okay. But it's also important that things go the way that you want them to. And the way that that's best done is by being really clear about what you want. And the people who love you will appreciate how clear you've been because then they're going to be able to do what you want. If you're interested in learning more about the topic of future planning, getting your arrangements in order, Dementia Australia has a webinar about that called Future Planning. You can find the webinar on Dementia Australia's website: dementia.org.au.

Jim: And if you've got any questions about anything you've heard on this episode, just contact the National Dementia Helpline on 1800 100 500. Their trained advisors are available 24 hours a day, every day of the year.

[END OF RECORDED MATERIAL]